Senedd Cymru | Welsh Parliament
Bil Aelod Arfaethedig – Mark Isherwood AS | Proposed Member Bill - Mark Isherwood MS
Datblygu'r Bil Iaith Arwyddion Prydain (BSL) (Cymru) | Development of the British Sign Language (BSL) (Wales) Bill
Ymateb gan: Tirweddau Cymru Landscapes Wales (TCLW) | Evidence from: Tirweddau Cymru Landscapes Wales (TCLW)
The British Sign Language Act 2022 requires the UK Government to issue guidance about the promotion and facilitation of the use of British Sign Language (BSL). This however only applies in England and not to the Welsh Government or public bodies in Wales such as councils or the NHS. The British Sign Language (BSL) (Wales) Bill aims to place equivalent specific duties on the Welsh Government and public bodies in Wales.
Tirweddau Cymru Landscapes Wales (TCLW) is a partnership of the eight Designated Landscapes in Wales, our five National Landscapes and three National Park Authorities, which are recognized for their rich natural beauty, environmental and cultural value.
Our Designated Landscapes have purposes enshrined in legislation which include a duty to promote access and opportunities for the enjoyment and understanding of the special qualities of Wales’ most special green and blue spaces. It follows that inclusion and engagement with our communities and visitors is at the heart of the important work of our Designated Landscapes. We welcome any initiative which supports our work to connect more people with nature. As Public Bodies, our Designated Landscapes are also subject to other important equality legislation, such as the Public Sector Equality Duty, ensuring that the advancement of equality must be considered when carrying out their day-to-day business, and the Well-being of Future Generations (Wales) Act 2015, both of which must be reported on annually.
It therefore follows that Wales’ Designated Landscapes, in principle, support the introduction of the British Sign Language (Wales) Bill which seeks to promote the use and recognition of British Sign Language (BSL) as an official language of Wales.
Designated landscapes, as both living and working landscapes and special places that attract many visitors, would benefit from being more accessible to people who use BSL. Integrating BSL into services and information within our Designated Landscapes would ensure that the beauty and cultural significance of these areas are accessible to a broader audience, including those who are deaf or hard of hearing, helping to promote inclusion and a greater awareness of BSL and the Deaf community. This could include offering BSL interpreters at events, accessible visitor information, training staff in basic BSL to assist visitors, and a BSL complaints procedure, thereby enhancing the overall experience for Deaf and hard-of-hearing individuals.
Overall, the introduction of the British Sign Language (Wales) Bill would complement and enhance the ethos of Wales' Designated Landscapes by making them more inclusive, accessible, and reflective of valuing the cultural and linguistic diversity of Wales. This initiative would be a progressive step towards ensuring that Wales' natural heritage is enjoyed by everyone, regardless of their method of communication.
However, given the current funding and resource challenges of Designated Landscapes, in this consultation response, we would like to draw attention to some reservations and concerns with regards to how these aims are to be delivered and the expectations and requirements of Designated Landscapes, including:
- Setting realistic and effective BSL standards – noting concerns over ensuring an adequate number of qualified BSL interpreters, particularly in rural areas;
- How reporting is to be carried out; and
- What support / guidance / training / toolkits etc will be provided
We would welcome continued engagement with TCLW on these developments if helpful.
We fully agree with the main aims of the proposed Bill to:
· support the removal of barriers that currently exist for deaf people and their families across Wales in education, health, public services, support services and in the workplace;
· ensure that people who use BSL are not treated less favourably than those who speak Welsh or English;
· provide deaf communities with a voice in the design and delivery of services they use to ensure they meet their needs;
· establish a BSL Commissioner with the same powers as other minority language Commissioners;
· place a reporting duty on the proposed Commissioner, Welsh Government and public bodies.
However, we would like to draw attention to the below comments and concerns with regards to how these aims are to be delivered and the expectations and requirements of Designated Landscapes.
Implementation costs
As we are all aware, public bodies are currently facing incredibly challenging financial times. National Parks and National Landscapes are no exception. Our Welsh Designated Landscapes are small public organisations with a number of competing priorities currently working off a significant reduction in real terms funding
We ask that the Bill and Commissioner takes account of this financial context, rather than introducing expectations and measures which are applicable to organisations with unlimited capacity and resources. TCLW would very much welcome initiatives which offer funding, guidance, and / or integrate requirements into current processes.
In order to assist public bodies to forward plan, a Regulatory Impact Assessment identifying likely costs of the Bill would be welcome. We would also welcome discussions around introducing requirements under the Bill as a staged process, allowing public bodies time to integrate costs, and potentially exploring sector specific requirements which are relative to different public bodies, taking into account e.g. available resources and delivery scope and priorities.
BSL Standards
· There is a need to ensure the BSL standards are realistic, effective and focused on ensuring the most important issues for BSL users are addressed within them. There is a risk sometimes that language standards can involve spending significant resource on e.g. bureaucratic document translation that in practice few people read in any language except for specific professionals rather than focusing effort on areas with most impact. TCLW would welcome a realistic and practical approach to standards that considers the target user group needs and context, for example:
o The option to provide ‘easy read’ or e.g. Makaton as an alternative where this would be more appropriate, for instance, when working with people with learning disabilities.
o It would also be helpful if for example you could ask participants ahead of public meetings if they would benefit from BSL translators being present rather than making them an automatic requirement.
· Consideration is needed in terms of the relationship the standards will have with Reasonable Adjustment requirements under the Equality Act (recognising that BSL is more than a reasonable adjustment as a language and has cultural, community and identity values for users), in particular, will the standards expectation go beyond what would be considered reasonable under the Equality Act and does it expand further on the anticipatory aspect.
· The explanatory memorandum notes issues around language professionals, standards of their BSL, and also the availability of RSLIs. This causes concern in terms of the potential ability of public bodies to be able to meet standards in terms of being able to access suitable professionals, particularly in rural areas, ensuring that value for money can be achieved when sourcing professionals, and having guarantee that information is being explained / received accurately through the interpretation process. It would be useful to develop a shared procurement framework for BSL services for public bodies which public bodies can access and as part of being on this framework relevant checks are in place to ensure BSL professionals meet / continue to be meet certain professional standards.
· As it is likely that the standards expectations will go beyond what is currently required via reasonable adjustment requirements, clarity is needed on what areas the standards will apply to in terms of service delivery, publication of information (there is significant cost involved here – so it is important to be clear where are BSL videos required and how will this be resourced), public engagement, governance and employment. It is important that the standards are co-produced with both BSL users and public bodies. Co-production will help increase public bodies understanding of best practice and develop potential joint solutions with BSL users in more challenging areas were resource or lack of access to suitable professionals may be an issue.
Reporting
It is noted that the consultation states that “The Bill will also place a duty on other public bodies to report on their progress in promoting and facilitating BSL through the Well-being of Future Generations (Wales) Act 2015 (WFGA) reporting cycle. Ensuring that BSL is fed into the WFGA cycle would embed BSL into existing policy and legal frameworks within Wales.”
There are an increasing number of duties being placed on Welsh public bodies with reporting requirements. It is important that what is stated above is made clear within the legislation and that the legislation is worded to make it explicit that Public Bodies can report progress through their Annual Report on Meeting Well-being Objectives (or equivalent reports) or that they can report it within Annual Equality Reports (links with Specific Duties).
We have found that while Welsh Government have been more open to mainstreaming of reporting within some areas for duties, generally separate Commissioners are not so open to this. If a separate report is expected, then the Commissioner should create a simple reporting template all public bodies can use and submit annually for reporting. Clarity should also be provided in terms of publication requirements including whether a BSL video of the report would be required (and information provided as part of work on this Bill of estimated costs of producing BSL videos to help public bodies build these costs into future budgeting activities for meeting corporate reporting requirements).
Establish a BSL Advisory Panel
TCLW supports the creation of a BSL Advisory Panel made up of Welsh BSL signers. Provision of guidance for public services would be welcome. It would be beneficial to explore options in terms of forms to enable public bodies to explain potential challenges they may face in meeting standards with the BSL Advisory Panel, and develop a process to work jointly to develop solutions.
5-year report on the position of BSL in this period
TCLW supports the production of a 5-year report – this report will provide data that can help to inform our work. It should consider cultural, community and identity considerations for BSL users and also outline information on regional dialects (has any research been carried out to map regional BSL dialects across Wales?).
Integrated Assessments/ Checklists and Toolkits/ Training
· In terms of “support the removal of barriers that currently exist for deaf people and their families across Wales in education, health, public services, support services and in the workplace” and “ensure that people who use BSL are not treated less favourably than those who speak Welsh or English” will there be an expectation that BSL be added as a specific section to integrated assessments?
· Could the advisory panel / commissioner develop a set of simple practical checklists that public bodies could use to help them implement standards and improve user experience for BSL users in terms of e.g. making arrangements for a one-on-one interview, hosting a public meeting (in person, hybrid, online etc).
· Part of the Commissioner role should be around developing training for public bodies.
· Consideration is also needed around skills levels of staff who may have some level of BSL knowledge, what level of BSL skill may be needed for different activities, and trigger points for when a professional interpreter is needed.
BSL Complaints Procedure
TCLW supports the establishment of a BSL complaints procedure for the investigation of complaints as we recognise the current limited avenues for BSL users / signers to make complaints. We welcome more details and discussion around how this can be both centralised and also utilised effectively by our staff for specific local issues and procedures, for instance with respect to planning applications.
Yes
Don’t know.
As public bodies and not as members of the Deaf or BSL user community we do not have the lived experience to respond meaningfully to this question, however, local Welsh dialects are part of the special qualities associated with our different landscapes and are therefore of importance.
Don’t know.
As public bodies and not as members of the Deaf or BSL user community we do not have the lived experience to respond meaningfully to this question.
Don’t know
As public bodies and not as members of the Deaf or BSL user community we do not have the lived experience to respond meaningfully to this question.
Neither agree or disagree.
There are examples of our Designated Landscapes nurturing the voice of the deaf community. Pembrokeshire Coast National Park Authority developed a relationship with the local Sign and Share club who asked for better access to National Park events. A recent Shared Prosperity Fund project, Open to All, helped to build on that connection and delivered BSL interpretated events in 2024, such as tours of Carew Castle and the Park’s annual archaeology day.
Strongly agree.
As public bodies and not as members of the Deaf or BSL user community we do not have the lived experience to respond meaningfully to this question.
Transport.
Consistently raised as an issue. TCLW can only answer the above question from the perspective of Designated Landscapes and have highlighted transport as a consistent issue for visitors and our communities. Staff recognise that clearer timetables would support better access for the Deaf and BSL user community.
The Bill proposes to establish a BSL Commissioner who would promote and facilitate the use of BSL, and would have the same powers as other minority language Commissioners such as in the Welsh Language (Wales) Measure 2011.
Yes.
TCLW welcomes the role of the Commissioner to provide guidance and a process for public bodies to promote and facilitate BSL in their respective domains.
Yes – we would also ask that the Commissioner is suitably qualified for the role, with working knowledge of both BSL and the public sector.
Yes – but could include specialist advisors who have worked with the deaf community.
As public bodies and not as members of the Deaf or BSL user community we do not have the lived experience to respond meaningfully to this question.
Don’t know – as outlined above, TCLW welcomes further clarity over standards and the reporting expectations on public bodies.
TCLW fully supports that those who use BSL and the Deaf community should be fully involved in the design, delivery and monitoring of the services they use, to ensure their most important needs are prioritised. The BSL Advisory Panel has huge potential, and we would welcome any engagement with the Panel on guidance for public bodies around the comments and feedback in this consultation response.
There are also likely to be learning opportunities for the Bill from public bodies in relation to meeting / delivering Welsh Language standards.